Sus,Deca,Dianabol

Hi Guys,
How do you rate the following cycle as my 2nd ever cycle.
Sustanon ?mg per week
Deca ?mg per week
Dianabol 30mg per day

45 y
88kg
19% BF

Regards
NB

Hi North,

Sounds like a 980's cycle...we have since moved past the 1 sus, 1 deca per week with a dose of dianabol in the mix...what you would like to take in consideration the drug lifes of these chemicals and try to run in their threshold so that you wont encounter any side effects...So basicaly try a max cycle.
Day 1 to 5 - 250 mg Sust, only run dianabols for the first 3 day's to ramp the plasma levels up.
Day 6 to 10 - 200 mg Deca Nandrolone with 50 mg Nadro Prop by PGW

This is a mild cycle that I will advice you try, just remember to add some proviron for aromatasation (from the prop in the sust).

The Scientist

Thanks Prof.
I don't know Nadro Prop by PGW and where to obtain.
Sorry, I know this is not an online shop. Does the T+C allow to mail me.
EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED
Regards
NB

Day 1 to 5 - 250 mg Sust, only run dianabols for the first 3 day's to ramp the plasma levels up.
Day 6 to 10 - 200 mg Deca Nandrolone with 50 mg Nadro Prop by PGW

I dont understand. Day = week? Or 1 Sust/5days?
Week 6-10?

just remember to add some proviron for aromatasation (from the prop in the sust).

Test Prop aromatizing? I thought that Prop aromatizes the least of all?

Please also clarify this.

OK WTF!!!

Well done JR1 for being so polite.
I'm gonna ignore some good advice about keeping your mouth shut and let them think you're a fool....!!

@ Scientist, either you are onto some awesome Pro Bodybuilding inside track drug regime or you are full of it.

You just recommended a 10 day steroid cycle & some of those anabolics have a half life of close to 14 days. Seriously WTF!!!
Please explain in detail how this cycle works.

@ all the new guys & Keith and the rest of FNB. Do a lot more reading, here and elsewhere.
I recon beast labs is maybe just repackaging diluted product from someone else (PGW?)
Take the above advice at your peril.

It's called a "ramp" cycle - you ramp up levels very quickly and then "ride it out" on the compounds half life. Very similar to Author L Rea's principles in CME II. Has less HPT-axis suppression and makes for shorter, more effective cycles. I used this successfully in the past. Most cycle's gains are anyway in the first 3-4 weeks, then cortisol catches up and gains plateau off.
As for the prop that aromatizes. Propionate is just an ester - it can structurally not aromatize - testosterone does. 100mg Test-prop has more free test than 100mg Test-cipionate - it sounds funny, but about 86mg vs 74mg. So, yeah, Testo-prop will aromatize more than Test-cyp at the same dosages.

Thanks for the explanation Doc.
I thought its the fact that Test-Prop doesn't stick around very long because of the short ester that minimizes aromatization.

@ Doc, Thanks for the explanation of Scientist input.

Sounds like an interesting approach. What I find difficult to accept is that as little as 200mg of deca is reported to shut you down, never mind 200mg / day over four days. Surely that will slam your test production, never mind the 1250mg of Test floating around.

With anabolics that are not as harsh on the HPTA, this ramp approach would make more sense to me.

In your, or anyone else’s experience, how does this approach compare to the more "Traditional" approach as far as gains, PCT & maintaining gains go?

@ Scientist, maybe you're not so full of it.:blush:
But I think this approach is still a bad way to go for a 45 year old first time user, who does not know his way around never mind how his body may react!

Hi Doc, thanks for the explenation of the Max cycle as Author calls it.

Oupiel...I hear what you say about age and all those relevant information that you need, but in this case I work with what I got...idealy I would like to get the guy in the lab and run some Blood test to see what shortages we have to attend to.

On the cycle itself: The example as shown induced a daily plasma level of about 250mg daily until
day #16. At that point the plasma level gradually ramped-down (tapered off) until
about day #26. This keeps us in the 30 day of high activity before the body's cortisol, estrogen and prolactin shoots up.

Pct on a cycle like this will be of most important...
I will start on day 8 with a 12 day Proviron and Nolvadex on day 1 and Proviron and Trilostane (I know this was availible a couple of years ago under the trade name of Low Presser Teslac

This kind of cycle wound blow you up as we all are use to with the traditional cycles.It will maybe add 3 or 4 kg's to your weight, but it will be 3 or 4 of pure muscle.

Thanks

The Scientist

1250mg of Test floating around

Thats the other thing i just dont understand as well.
When i used 200mg of TestProp i could feel my blood pressure going up and it was actually quite uncomfortable. Other sides also followed. 1.5 days later it subsided again and often it was quite a relief. I eventually stuck to +- 1.5 ml(150mg) EOD.

How on earth do you tollerate 250 mg/day? And this wont start subsiding for at least 2 weeks? (or was that 3 for sustenon)

Verrrrry interesting subject this.

jackrabbit1 wrote:

1250mg of Test floating around

Thats the other thing i just dont understand as well.
When i used 200mg of TestProp i could feel my blood pressure going up and it was actually quite uncomfortable. Other sides also followed. 1.5 days later it subsided again and often it was quite a relief. I eventually stuck to +- 1.5 ml(150mg) EOD.

How on earth do you tollerate 250 mg/day? And this wont start subsiding for at least 2 weeks? (or was that 3 for sustenon)

Verrrrry interesting subject this.

Chemicals in general is interesting...but yes I was refering to the Prop i the Sust where the Prop is only 30mg/ml

Aaah! so what you're saying is that, in 5 days using Sust250, i will only have 5X30 = 150/2 = +-75mg of Test floating around? The rest are longer esters and are still in the process of getting broken down?
So the effect will be way less than my 2.5 X 200mg of TestProp in the same timeframe explained above?

Ok, with that logic, sust is probaly the best compound to use i.e Prop for fast elevation of blood levels and the longer esters to maintain levels to day 16.
Would the same logic also work with the NPP & Deca?

Clear up your thoughts on SERM & AI's for me, I'm not following. Nolvadex from day 1 i.e. 20mg/day for 10 days or 20 days?
Proviron from day 8 to day 20?

OuPiel - As far as i have it, NPP only really drops off sharply after day 5. You Stop the NPP after the first deca shot has already been in for 5 days giving you a total of 10 days, so the deca will be active when the npp fades away.

I'm still not sure about the whole Nolva/Kessar and 19Nor debate. Not willing to take chances.

I found that Proviron really worked when i was on my TestProp/Npp cycle. Especially when i upped it to 75mg-100mg/day.

Yes basically we would like to also get a faster Nandrolone so we have to use the Deca Phenylpropionate to ramp up plasma levels like the prop in sust.Active life of aound 2 days.

On the Pct we will start with the Nolvadex and Proviron from day 8 (I think I made a mistake in my previous post).

Thanks

What do you scientists say is the reason why Nandrolone propionate isn't possible?

jackrabbit1 wrote:

I'm still not sure about the whole Nolva/Kessar and 19Nor debate. Not willing to take chances.
quote]

Ya I'm with you on that, I think I'd rather go with an AI (letro) than do the nolvadex angle. But that's realy an E control discussion / debate.

I got to admit that this ramp angle is looking realy attractive. As I said during my last cycle, 12 weeks of eating , sleeping, breathing bodybuilding is tough on your motivation and that's even before you start PCT.

Hi Jackrabbit,

I'm not saying that Nandrolone Propionate is not possible to use, just had alot of good results on the Phenylpropionate ester.

10 days of injections will have you searching for pin-sites though!:S

I've never heard of Nandro propionate - thats why i was curios as to the reason why noone is manufacturing this.

Isn't it a molecular weight thing? where the amount of Nandro you can suspend in Prop is so little that its just not worth it?
Please.... i'm scaring myself with the possibility of talking too much kak here?!?!?!:laugh:

No no don't be scared Rabbit...lol,

What you want to do is exactly that...inject every day into a muscle to localized the growth on site and ramp the plasma level up...now I'm getting into something again...but here goes...if you want to take full advantage of the situation at hand you would want to add 3ml of synthol to your Test or Deca every day...this will help creating space so that your muscle got room to grow as we call it...

PGW got a Nandro Prop that I use on some of my clients.

PGW got a Nandro Prop that I use on some of my clients.

But thats a phenyl-Prop.

Yes and that also got an active life of 2 to 3 days exactly what you need to match the prop ramp from the sust...

The Scientist wrote:

Hi North,

Sounds like a 980's cycle.

The Scientist

Well i ran that as my 2nd cycle and got HUGE gains (not saying its the best) but it worked very well for me

Happyraven,

Thanks, I will start my 2nd cycle in two weeks time. Hope to gain the same as you.

NB1

You won't regret it mate... If the gear is real, you'll put on good size.

I'd run 500mg/week Sustanon
400mg/week Deca
30 or 40mgs/day (first 4 weeks) of Dianabol

Just make sure you have a decent PCT lined up