ANABOLIC CYCLE ADVICE

Hi All

Any inputs would be appreciated.

28 Years old
1.76 M
18% B/F
86 KG's
5-th Cycle

I bought all of the following and was thinking of stacking it this way.

2 Boxes of Depotrone
10 ml's of Equipoise 350 mg/ml
12 ml's of Winstrol 50 mg/ml (Left from a previous stack)
50 Tabs of Winstrol - 10 mg/tabs
10 Tabs of Kessar 20 mg tabs
100 Tabs of Clen 0.02 mg tabs
10 Tabs of Clomid 50 mg tabs
Milk Thistle: (Already using)
Proscar
(Still need to get HCG)

Week 1 to 5:
Depotrone: 2 amps (400 mg) per week
Equipoise: 1 ml (350 mg) per week

Week 6 to 10
Depotrone: 2 amps (400 mg per week)
Winstrol: 3 ml per week - (for first 4 weeks then go over to tabs for week 10)
Equipoise: 1 ml (350 mg) per week
Clen: 1 tab every second day - 2 weeks on 2 weeks off ?

Week 10 Continue: PCT
HCG: 1500 IU
Kessar: 1 tab every day (20 mg) - Mon to Fri
Proscar: Qauter tab every day

Week 11:
HCG: 1500 IU
Kessar: 1 tab evey day (20 mg) - Mon to Fri
Clomid: 1 tab every day (50 mg) - Mon to Fri
Proscar: Qauter tab every day

Week 12:
HCG: 1500 IU
Clomid: 1 tab every day (50 mg) - Mon to Fri
Proscar: Qauter tab every day

Week 13:
Proscar: Qauter tab every night

Week 14:
Proscar: Qauter tab every night

Week 15 to 20
Proscar: Qauter tab every night

Supplements SA Testoblast tabs -maintanence use - to raise test levels slightly again

All of this is together with a clean high protein diet with the following supplements:
5 protein shakes per day (Pure whey)
Creatine twice a day on training days - once a day - non training
Strong Multivit every day
CLA every day

I am on MAX O T Bulking Program - Works gr8
Train Mon to Fri - one bodypart per day - rest Sat & Sun

My goal is obviously to add lean muscle mass & then start cutting down on some B/F at the end.

All your inputs would be greatly appreciated.

add in at least another deptorone ampule to that cycle per week... 600mg minimum

Thank you DJ-Easye

I will add one more ampule per week - if I can still get this stuff - bought it when it was still readily available. Otherwise I might opt to add 1 ampule sust per week.

How does the rest of the stack look like ?

Anything else someone can recommend ?

I'm not 100 % happy with the stacking of the PCT.

Thanks

u can add in sust or even testoviron which is testosterone enanthate...

not a bad stack bro..

Why proscar only at week 10 - 12 . Im guessing you taking it because of hair loss sides? You want proscar to prevent as much as possible the conversion of test into dht so by taking it during your PCT that makes no sense. You should run it from day one or atleast start at week 2 or 3 when your depo starts kicking in.And if you do have hair sides know this that estrogen also plays a huge role in hair loss so .5 Adex throughout your cycle or letro will help here. Ok if you dont have hair sides then just ignore this but then again why proscar in the PCT

Thanks Guys

Yes - Proscar for hair loss - I meant to say from week 10 onwards and carry on for at least 2 months after that. I have alot of this - so taking it is not a problem.

The reason I'm only staring at week 10, is that I was told that Proscar and Equipoise should not be stacked together - what are your thoughts ?

Thanks again.

ok well sorry i didnt see the part of ur pct there,u cant start pct the week after your depotrone and equi shots,u need to wait two weeks,i suggest moving your winstrol into those two week on its own so u dry out before u start pct. clen 1 tab every second day? nope,more like 5 x20mcg tabs every day for 2weeks.

Kat wrote:

Thanks Guys

Yes - Proscar for hair loss - I meant to say from week 10 onwards and carry on for at least 2 months after that. I have alot of this - so taking it is not a problem.

The reason I'm only staring at week 10, is that I was told that Proscar and Equipoise should not be stacked together - what are your thoughts ?

Thanks again.

If you take propeica with eq, it will make the eq undergo 5 alpha reduction, and then you will end up with 1-test ( 1-test is dihydroboldenone). So, taking propecia with eq will help a lil bit, but not much my friend. Finasteride is really only gold with plain ol testoserone. BUT hair loss on eq is very small and usually on higher dosages. Since you only going for 250 mgs you shouldnt have a problem. So you should be taking proscar from the beginning of the cycle my friend cause the test will make your hair go quick.

IMHO

Test is on the low side. Would definitely up that a bit. 500mg pw minimum, but more like 750mg if it's your 5th cycle (but of course i don't know how you respond to test, some guys do fantastically well on 500mg/w even after 10 cycles).

Not sure if your clen dosage is a mistype, but it's way too low.

Proscar from day 1 inmo. The test is more likely to lead to hair loss (if that is a concern) than the eq.

PCT should start about 2 weeks after last shot.

Lesa wrote:

Kat wrote:

Thanks Guys

Yes - Proscar for hair loss - I meant to say from week 10 onwards and carry on for at least 2 months after that. I have alot of this - so taking it is not a problem.

The reason I'm only staring at week 10, is that I was told that Proscar and Equipoise should not be stacked together - what are your thoughts ?

Thanks again.

If you take propeica with eq, it will make the eq undergo 5 alpha reduction, and then you will end up with 1-test ( 1-test is dihydroboldenone). So, taking propecia with eq will help a lil bit, but not much my friend. Finasteride is really only gold with plain ol testoserone. BUT hair loss on eq is very small and usually on higher dosages. Since you only going for 250 mgs you shouldnt have a problem. So you should be taking proscar from the beginning of the cycle my friend cause the test will make your hair go quick.

Thanks Lesa, I just learned something, AGAIN. I don't worry about hair loss, cos it's all just about gone anyway :lol: But that was interesting, never knew that.

Supplements SA Testoblast tabs -maintanence use - to raise test levels slightly again

When do use this? During cycle or PCT?

How well does this work? Have you tried it before?

Very important, DO NOT start PCT straight after the last Test and EQ shots. You should definitely wait about 3 weeks after your last EQ shot or your kessar and clomid will be wasted. 10 kessar is not enough anyway bud. EQ has an even longer clearance time than Test because of the longer ester. You should generally start pct 2 weeks after test cyp/enan, 3/4 days after test prop and 3 weeks after Deca and EQ. Otherwise you will be starting PCT to get your body producing its own LH while your HPTA is still suppressed by the EQ -which is pointless. HCG should also be used before you start kessar/clomid because although it brings your balls back it is still suppressive on your HPTA (google this if you dunno what it is) and will make the kessar/clomid less effective.

Like the others have said start Proscar now to prevent test converting to DHT. EQ is 5 alpha reduced to 1-test which is less androgenic than DHT and EQ doesn't bind with 5ar as easy as test does. Deca should not be taken with proscar/propecia but EQ is fine. If you are unsure about when to start PCT do some more research on the big steroid boards. Its worth the time. Knowledge is power -and more muscle kept post cycle If you have been doing PCT like that your last few cycles then it could be your reason you are only 86KGs at 18% bf after 4 cycles. PCT is as important as your cycle so good thing you asked. Good luck man.

Found the following post - comments? I'm on Deca/EQ as well as a bucket test, so this is interesting.

forums.isteroids.com/anabolic-steroids-q...eca-finasteride.html

Hope this post helps your question, i too am a hair fanatic so i understand your pain bro...

First off, let me preface this by saying that this is true, in certain contexts.
However, I'm an advocate of including testosterone in every cycle, so my explanation is with the assumption that one will be using nandrolone in addition to testosterone

For those that do not know, testosterone converts to DHT via the 5 alpha reductase enzyme. DHT is far more androgenic than testosterone and is the main contributor to MPB in those genetically predisposed.

finasteride is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor, and therefore limits the conversion of testosterone to DHT via competitive inhibition.

Nandrolone itself is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor (although it yields DHN in the process). So less DHT is produced if nandrolone is present. Also, DHN is much less androgenic than nandrolone and much less androgenic than DHT. So, finasteride with deca (nandrolone) should both work to reduce DHT levels, and since finasteride will inhibit 5a reductase, it'll also keep levels of DHN lower too.

The misconception that deca with finasteride is a bad combination stems from the the days when deca only cycles were more common If one were running a deca only cycle (or any deca cycle without test), then finasteride would be a poor choice, because DHN is less androgenic than nandrolone. However, since we're assuming test to be included in a deca cycle, and both test and DHT are far more androgenic than nandrolone, if your goal is preventing the formation of the most androgenic compounds, then both deca and finasteride work together to reduce DHT formation.

To sum things up, if you're running a test + deca cycle and are worried about MPB (and you're susceptible), then including finasteride is a far better option than NOT including it, although the nandrolone will help to reduce DHT formation on its own to some extent.

DHB is more of a poten androgen than DHN but still your post proves that finasteride should be taken from the beginning of the course.

Hi Guys

Thanks alot for all of this information.

I am so glad that I decided to ask you guys as every one of you made
extremely valid and important points.

LESA - Thanks - I will definately be taking the proscar from day 1 - do you
agree with the dose of a qauter tablet - as this is what my doctor suggested ?

DJEASYE - I will most definately extend the winny - (as I have got more than enough)
to week 11 & 12 and then only start PCT from week 13.
As for the clen - I will follow your advise as wel and take
5 * 20 mcg tabs e/d for 2 weeks - but what
week should I start taking this - at week 6 or week 8 - or week 10 ?

SHAUNRSA - I will definately up my test - on my 4-th stack I responded well
to 400 mg per week - but will take your advise and up it for my 5-th cycle.
What would you add though - Sust or Deca ? I opted to add sust - but what
would be the better choice?
Supplements SA testo blast will be 3 weeks after the last PCT - and I know
this product works - I used it before - this is merely to raise the natural
test slightly again after the drop of PCT.

MUSCLEADDICT: Thanks for all this info - especially the Kessar and Clomid -
If I start PCT only from week 13 - (3 weeks) should I then start Kessar &
Clomid from week 16?

JACKRABBIT1: Thank you for all this info as well - I am a hair fanatic like yourself - and lost a bit with
2 of my first stacks - being simple stacks - depotrone & anabol. If I follow you correctly - you would add some deca to
the depotrone?

Thanks again guys - this is a great forum with people that know what they are talking about.

Kat wrote:

Hi Guys



SHAUNRSA - I will definately up my test - on my 4-th stack I responded well
to 400 mg per week - but will take your advise and up it for my 5-th cycle.
What would you add though - Sust or Deca ? I opted to add sust - but what
would be the better choice?

Sust. You want to increase the Test. You are taking EQ anyway, no need for Deca imo.

Oh, and this is important, don't just start taking 100mcg of Clen a day. You need to start low and increase slowly depending on your reaction to it.
Start with 20mcg or even 40mcg a day and increase dosages slowly.

Thanks Shaunrsa

Will add sust.

Will retype the complete stack and see what you guys think.

Hi All

To conclude and I have taken everyone's advice on this - here is the stack I want to follow: Please comment if you feel anything should be changed.

Week 1 to 5:
Depotrone: 2 amps (400 mg) per week
Sust: 250 mg pw
Equipoise: 1 ml (350 mg) per week
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 6 to 10
Depotrone: 2 amps (400 mg per week)
Sust: 250 mg pw
Winstrol: 3 ml (150 mg) per week - (for first 4 weeks then go over to tabs for week 10)
Equipoise: 1 ml (350 mg) per week
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 8 to 10 Continue:
Clen: 5 tabs ed

Week 11 to 12:
Winstrol tabs:
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 13
HCG: 1500 IU
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 14
HCG: 1500 IU
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 15
HCG: 1500 IU
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 16:
Kessar: 1 tab every day (20 mg) - Mon to Fri
Clomid: 1 tab every day (50 mg) - Mon to Fr1
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

Week 17:
Kessar: 1 tab evey day (20 mg) - Mon to Fri
Clomid: 1 tab every day (50 mg) - Mon to Fri
Propecia: Qauter tab ed

5 tabs of Clen per day, week 8 to 10?

How strong are the tabs?

Remember what you were told about tapering up?

Are you only going to run the Clen for 2 weeks?

Hi Shaunrsa

The tabs are 0.02 mg

I will most definatelt remember to taper up the dose.

I have got 100 0.02 mg tabs - so should I get more and run for longer ?

Kat wrote:

Hi Shaunrsa

The tabs are 0.02 mg

I will most definatelt remember to taper up the dose.

I have got 100 0.02 mg tabs - so should I get more and run for longer ?

You will need more.

You can cycle 2 weeks on/ 2 weeks off and run for longer.

You can get some ketotifen and run it for longer (maybe 6 weeks) without cycling.

I suggest you read this www.anabolicsteroids.co.za/forum?func=view&catid=4&id=15408

and this

www.anabolicsteroids.co.za/forum?func=view&catid=4&id=429

Hi Shaunrsa

Thanx for the links I read all the info - I will definately get some more clen and then also look at the ketotifen - 6 weeks sounds good.

I havent started with the stack yet - but I want to make this stack count - so really appreciate all of the info.

I would never run EQ for less than 12 weeks, maybe start off with eq 2 weeks before you even start your cycle as it takes around 4 weeks to start seeing the affects of it where as test you see after the first week.

thats my 2 cent...

Thanx 00pump

That makes sense - I just need to see if I can get some extra Equipoise - and also I want to start ASAP with the stack - and I am still waiting on my Sust and HCG - as I am in PE and I get my stuff from JHB - so it takes a while.

But definately a valid point - thanks.