Bruno's First Cycle Log

Dc training is intense. A few years back when I still had a workout partner I tried rest pause style dc training... You need to have balls of steel to do proper rest pause squats at a sufficiently heavy weight. Give me 20 rep squats any day.. At least with that the first 10 reps are relatively easy.

That's why u gotta start small. I have seen posts about ifbb pros starting a dc program squatting 60kgs. 3 second negative, sit in the box for 2 seconds then explode up. Gotta start small or u injure yourself quickly!!

I realise that now... I was young and brave (aka stupid lol) then so used 90kg or 100kg at a time when my 5 rep max was 120.

No surprise that I didn't last long on dc training! If I had a training partner to spot me and could get past my ego re dropping weights so low I would give it a go again: looks like a promising alternative to traditional weight training.

Weight currently sitting at 92kgs and getting first comments about how I'm starting to look bigger. Don't really feel "on" but having some strength increase on most of my lifts, which is great :woohoo:

Last night my wife spotted 1 spot of bacne at the base of my neck...hopefully its just something random and not the start of some nasty acne. What do you guys do on cycle to combat acne? I'm showering in the mornings on waking up and evenings after gym.

Also, nads are definitely starting to shrink. Should I start HCG sooner and just get another vial (to last till PCT) when I get my bridge goodies? I want a smooth as possible PCT since my last week of PCT is going to be in Ramadan.

Bruno wrote: With respect to training on cycle, do you guys stick to a regular 4/5 day a week split

where you do one body part a week or do you train full body workouts? Somewhere in

between, ie training same body part twice let week? I'm concerned that I may be

training sub optimally while on cycle.

I am so glad somebody else is questioning this. There is so much evidence and studies that shows to cause suffice muscle damage for regrowth you don't need to dedicate an entire workout for one body-part, hence lifting compounds and exercising larger parts of the body (even full body) shows to be more beneficial. The question is, while on gear,can you cause muscle damage to a further extent when you exercise a specific body part a day, and so cause greater muscle damage as to induce better regrowth. AKA what are the rules that we can break while on gear? 'Cause I look at Pro athletes and they are all doing body-part specific splits. Either they are just following the norm or they know something I don't.

As of now I'm doing 2 workouts (Push/Pull) followed by a rest/cardio day. Logic being recovery is obviously better on gear so I can exercise the muscles more often, causing muscle damage more often, inducing muscle repair more often.

Furk wrote:

Bruno wrote: With respect to training on cycle, do you guys stick to a regular 4/5 day a week split

where you do one body part a week or do you train full body workouts? Somewhere in

between, ie training same body part twice let week? I'm concerned that I may be

training sub optimally while on cycle.

I am so glad somebody else is questioning this. There is so much evidence and studies that shows to cause suffice muscle damage for regrowth you don't need to dedicate an entire workout for one body-part, hence lifting compounds and exercising larger parts of the body (even full body) shows to be more beneficial. The question is, while on gear,can you cause muscle damage to a further extent when you exercise a specific body part a day, and so cause greater muscle damage as to induce better regrowth. AKA what are the rules that we can break while on gear? 'Cause I look at Pro athletes and they are all doing body-part specific splits. Either they are just following the norm or they know something I don't.

As of now I'm doing 2 workouts (Push/Pull) followed by a rest/cardio day. Logic being recovery is obviously better on gear so I can exercise the muscles more often, causing muscle damage more often, inducing muscle repair more often.

the way I see it we should be doing full body workouts as long as possible until recovery becomes an issue. Then slowly move over to a split by doing push pull or body part emphasis workouts without neglecting another part.

Right now I'm doing the latter (slightly different to my workout posted) ... Eg. Tues I start off with heavy squats and then move over to 3 or 4 chest exercise with emphasis on volume. Sat is the opposite, heavy incline bench and then 3 or 4 leg exercises. That way I know I'm stimulating a body part twice a week

I think the only way your going to completely trash a certain muscle is by giving it priority on its own day and making sure you destroy every fibre in its whole range of motion and then giving it a week to recover properly and doing it again. Maybe target a week body part twice a week but no more.
Look if your a beginner and only looking for mass then maybe the whole push and pull thing.
But I want to make sure the whole muscle is worked as I want the whole muscle to grow so that it's asthetically pleasing and not just over developed.
Iif you've trained Legs properly for instance you'll hardly be able to walk never mind thinking about moving on to chest. Like you may say squats and lunges are enough for legs but it's not without extensions ,leg press and all the other excercizes you'll grow big legs but you'll have no detail and your shape will probably suck. The same goes for all other muscles. And even though on cycle you may recover quicker but if you trash a muscle properly give it ample time to recover and grow.

Just my thoughts.

That's an interesting perspective Rhino which is worth looking into: heavy compound movements building muscle size and not aesthetically pleasing shape.

I usually read articles, etc relating to strength (cos that's my main interest and focus) so haven't come across anything supporting that but will definitely read up on it.

Rhino wrote: I think the only way your going to completely trash a certain muscle is by giving it priority on its own day and making sure you destroy every fibre in its whole range of motion and then giving it a week to recover properly and doing it again. Maybe target a week body part twice a week but no more.

Rhino, that's the normal route of thought body builders follow, and there is nothing wrong with that. But when I read that the studies prove that you don't need to hit the muscle from every single angle and you practically can't isolate single fibres, then you cross a line of muscle productivity. The research shows that to some point your just burning calories and generating lactic acid. The volume of stimulus required to effectively breakdown muscle fibre for later repair and hypertrophy is surprisingly low. My question is how AS breaks those rules? With AS can you break down more muscle from more angles and incorporate more isolation. When I find that answer bud, I'm jumping right on board with you on the body-part/day split.

Rhino wrote: I want the whole muscle to grow so that it's asthetically pleasing and not just over developed.

So do I bro, but there are lots of individuals with splits so basic I cannot comprehend how it is possible they are so aesthetic. Martin Berkhan for example, he boggles my friggen mind.

Rhino wrote: Like you may say squats and lunges are enough for legs but it's not without extensions ,leg press and all the other excercizes you'll grow big legs but you'll have no detail and your shape will probably suck.

I do agree that you need to focus on weak points, but making that statement without scientific backing is a bold claim. IFBB Pros and models provide visual and anecdotal evidence of their training (and their success could be in spite of better routines, not because) but I can't find any literature that scientifically supports the degree you can "destroy a muscle" while on AS for better results. Also, so many studies used "untrained individuals" like old men. What I really want is studies of "moerse sterk menere".

That's just my view gent and it works for me. Look at power lifters who only perform the compound movements... They look like shit.
I'm into bodybuilding and I can feel how different excercizes,stances and positioning all target different parts of the same muscle.

Rhino wrote: That's just my view gent and it works for me. Look at power lifters who only perform the compound movements... They look like shit.
I'm into bodybuilding and I can feel how different excercizes,stances and positioning all target different parts of the same muscle.

I agree. I can't provide scientific evidence though but I believe each muscle has to be hit @ all angles to build an aesthetic physique,not just muscular but with shape and definition

Look the biggest thing is there are 3 major main movements when it comes to bodybuilders and power lifters. Bench press, dead lift and squats. It essential that a lot of people build a program around those movements. They are the basic components of strength training and remember a big muscle is generally a strong one. After those there are other compound movements that u add to the 3 main ones
Then add in isolation movements to that and u have a basis of a strength and size program. That also the best rep range I have found and so have a lot of others is between 8-12 reps. Builds strength and size very quickly when done to failure.

Agreed all Workouts should be based around the 3 big compound movements. But I'd never base my training on cycle or not around a push day pull day repeat program I just don't see how you could train chest,shoulders,quads,triceps all in one session properly .
Maybe it works for some but I no if I really hit chest properly I'm done...
You just won't keep up the intensity for long enough to train all body parts to failure in on session.

I guess the differing views just proves that what works for one doesn't necessarily work for someone else; we unique and respond to different training methods.

For example, I've tried the 4 day split routines and I didn't grow or get stronger at all.. In fact I felt like I was regressing a bit. With the way I've been training in the recent past, I've gotten stronger than ever before and in the best shape I've ever been. Rhino, its clear that the opposite applies to you... You work better with a split.

Gotta disagree with you regarding keeping up the intensity when doing multiple body parts. For example, on Tuesday I really push myself on squats (after a squats my eyes are bloodshot) and I still have gas to finish a fairly hectic chest session of 13 to 15 sets (flat bench, incline bench, flyes and dips) till failure. I've added in leg press before but workouts took to long (have other commitments I gotta do after gym) so had to take it out. But even then I had the gas to push through.

In the end, we all gotta be open to different ways of training, try them all until you find what works for you and your goals.

But basic principles that DJ described should always be there though... Big 3, add some other key compound lifts and then isolation work as garnishing.

Agreed. I find it very interesting how different methods work for different people and I suppose the only way we all find out what works for us is trial and error.

It's also great to have a Gentalmans debate on the Forum again that hasn't turned nasty.

Look low volume training does work. But more for a strength aspect. If u want the strength and size then 8-12 reps is the place to be. I am not the hugest fan of lower volume but I am not gonna out and say it doesnt work. U need to learn your body.

If u look at dorian yates he was a lower volume guy a d he looked crazy. But injury wise?

Power lifters look monstrously big because 99.9% of th just eat shit all day. Having their shakes with double cream in order to get the calories in. Strong as all hell but do they make womens panties drop when they are on the beach? Naaaa. Not many woman find the Michelin man attractive. They more for the gi joe/super hero physiques. Which u won't get really training only for strength. But u do need strength to build big muscles. Its the combination of being strong for slightly higher volume that makes u big and makes women percolate like coffee machines... just saying

Percolate like Coffe machiens... Bwaahaha

@Furk: If you want you can open another thread and post some of those studies you liked the most then we can discuss them.

My view on training is that every muscle should go to extreme failure and not more- anything more is counterproductive. Take the guys training biceps, 5 exercises 3-4 sets each. The bicep is two muscles. Each muscle can only go to extreme failure on two accounts: once for positive failure and once for negative failure, and not seven times. There is no top failure and bottom failure and RHS failure and LHS failure and front failure and left diagonal failure. My way of thinking is to attack the group of muscles as a whole with a compound movement, this for many reasons especially creating stress and increasing testosterone. Thereafter attack each individual muscle seperately to ensure complete failure. During these isolation exercises the main focus is on negative failure (as positive failure comes easily).
i.e For a system to be in complete failure, every part of the system must be in complete failure.
Muscles grow only as a response to stress, and negative failure and compound movements create the most stress in the muscle and on the body.
I always laugh at people who train their inner chest, outer chest, then this exercise right here give you the lines on the bottom, etc. The chest is only TWO muscles! If you are going to train the inner pectoral muscle, then remember to also hit the right upper diagonal bicep muscle and the inner lower lat muscle. :lol:

After showering this evening I noticed that my nip's felt unusually sensitive :ohmy: I've always had puffy nipples that doesn't seem to go away as my bf% is decreasing...my little memento from puberty!

Hopefully its just something random and will be gone in a day or two (i hope!) but just in case, what course of action do you guys recommend? I have LP Letro on hand

Anyone? Nips are still sensitive... Not any worse but not any better either.

Were are u in your cycle ....start Letro at 3 drops ED if u still on cycle

Thanks Mike123.

I'm finishing off week 3 now only so didn't expect this sort of symptoms so early in a Test E Cycle.

I also get itchy nips on long ester tests, but the sides subside after about a week. It also happens around week 3 - 5..

Pic update 3 weeks in (took it this morning):



Weight still at 92kgs. Feel like I'm holding onto water (face seems abit bloated). Overall I am happy with the results so far considering the test is supposed to be in full swing in 3 weeks time!

Any feedback regarding lagging parts and what to do to address them will be much appreciated.

Oupa wrote: I also get itchy nips on long ester tests, but the sides subside after about a week. It also happens around week 3 - 5..

Does it subside on it own or do you take an AI? If it does on its own, should I just ride it out for a week and see what happens or start taking Letro @ 3 drops per day as Mike123 suggested?