Starting my first bulking cycle Friday ;-)

Greetings,

Any advice below on the cycle information and over all detail given would be appreciated.

I will be taking my first bulking cycle starting this week Friday. As per most of you may already know I have done a fair amount of research on this. Also I might be cutting this short and "starting a bit early" being a "bit over eager" to make some good progress as early as possible. My stats are 25, 180cm, 80kg. Genetically I loose weight fairly easily and get super fit rather with much ease. My diet is spot on, and I am taking great supplements. You could say I am gym fit and in routine. Also have a experienced pro body builder with amazing stats training me his not one to advice on supplementation of any sort. So far I was able to gain 5kilos of muscle mass without the use of any anabolics. Also have the ability to recover extreamly quick after a super intense training session. Train about 5 to 6 sometimes to even a full week for about 1 hour to 2 hours a session. Gradually this is becoming real easy and more a big role in my life style.

I have no idea how my body is going to react to the first cycle and this will most probably be the only cycle for this year at least. So its more a experimental trial and error for experience towards my long term goal.

Currently using ECA stack which has assisted me in keeping body fat down. Been experimenting with NoMAD + Heat. I found that mixing the two gives awesome results although it has some weird side effects.

Right, my cycle that I am starting with is as follows... Its oral, 9 weeks including PCT.

Week 1,2,3 = NoMAD Dianabol 25mg per day
Week 4 = NoMAD Dianabol 25mg + NoMAD Oxymethelone 50mg + Kessar 20mg per day
Week 5, 6 = NoMAD Dianabol 25mg + NoMAD Oxymethelone 50mg + Kessar 30mg per day
Week 7, 8 = NoMAD Dianabol 25mg + NoMAD Oxymethelone 50mg + Kessar 40mg per day
Week 9 = Kessar 30mg, Fertomid/Clomid 50mg per day

After this cycle, will push hard to maintain while on PCT and jump into a cutting cycle...

What milk thistle products are good to use as a precaution for the liver? Or is there any good advice I can get now before it all does go wrong terribly?

Allright I know it seems I think I got all the basics right and understand the risks involved. What last bits of advice can I have? Am I missing anything?


Please any fine tuning advice etc... please advice? Criticize if you have too, but let it be useful information!

Thanks in advance!

D-bol 8 weeks ??????? Max you should go is six and considering it's all oral even that is pushing it. Var is mild on your liver, but still hits it a little so I would seriously consider looking at duration of your cycle. Rather up your doseages over a shorter period and you will not keep allot of your gains with all oral either, just so that you are aware. PCT, Clomid - 5 days on (50mg) 5 days off and 5 days on at 50mg is the rule of thumb. I would recommend 4 weeks for d-bol at a slightly higher dose, but would actually shy away from an all oral cycle all together, just too rough and toxic and the gains keep is not worth it. Why not inject? If you scared of needles then I would say juice is not for you. To me orals are like the supplements of the AAS scene and like normal supplements they should be used in conjunction with the main compounds in a cycle. Another note, nomad d-bols are 10mg per tab, how you going to get 25 mg? The new tabs are small and difficult to cut so I would round the number and consider the 4 - 5 hr half life as well.

I would take Milk thistle and cruciale for liver protection and the compounds are fast acting so if something does go wrong you can react quickly by lowering doses or stopping.

Lastly, I would really consider injectibles as your results would be far better and more sustainable.

Oh yes, taking Kessar through out your cycle will suppress your gains so only use when needed.

As a note, maybe use Proviron in the last 2 weeks to shed water, but Doc would be best to comment on the impact on your liver etc.

Bro, I'm aware that your oral dosages aren't really high, but why don't you drop the Oxymethelone and rather use Testosterone Enanthate in your cycle?

30mg Dianabol / day for the first 4 weeks with 400mg - 500 mg Testen / week for 10 weeks will be a better option in my opinion.

I can see that you did do your research, but I think you will be more satisfied in the end if you include test with that cycle.

@vision. Dude ill share some wise words given to me a long time ago: "if you are not ready to inject you are not ready for steroids" An oral only cycle is a waist in most' opinion. It too toxic with too little gains kept post cycle. Mxt has some kick ass bulking cycles on the site, simple low dosage but very effective. Maybe check them out?

I'm a big fan of Testosterone only cycles for beginners... my fist cycle was 400mg Testosterone Enanthate per week and 30mg Anavar per day for 10 weeks...I had AMAZING gains in both muscle and strength and I didn't loose a gram of muscle after my PCT.

Wow, shot that is some good responses. From my understanding I know that oral is more toxic than anything else but thought with the low dosages it would be reasonably okay. Also know that injecting stays longer in the body but didnt think it would make a difference on the long term lasting effects of the muscle gains Okay, fair enough if I am going take this seriously I will have to look at injecting rather. Where can I find usefull information on where to inject and so forth? I have no prior experience with any form of injections... I have read some comments and statements on how its done but that doesn't mean I know what I am doing?!?!

Is it possible to inject "yourself" with most these substances? Rumor has it depending on what your injecting it can be rather painful.????

I will record my first cycle and what I end up doing / progress etc. And give you guys detailed feedback on any changes made and the lasting after effects... Maybe some of the information will be useful to other newbies.


Still what milk thistle products/brands do you guys use? Where can I get hold of some of them? I am not just going to by the first thing I find and assume its good

You can learn how to inject yourself here: www.spotinjections.com/index3.htm

Testen-300 is painless to inject and since the dosage per ml is high it also means that you only have to inject 1ml every 5 days or so depending on the dosage you want to use. The last thing you want at this stage is a low dosed product where you have to shoot 3ml+ per site.

Most people find Testosterone Propionate quite painful about a day after they injected it and it may last up to a week. Luckily I'm used to Prop and Winstrol inj so I have no pain at all.

Most milk thistle products are fine, just look for something thats good value for money.

Vision, I posted a thread with links on injection info and look at Batman's thread on syringe and needle brands to use. Just do a search and you should what you need. Milk Thistle I use is Holistix and you can get that from Dischem or a pharmacy, but just ask there for advice as well. I agree with dirk, if you don't want to inject then don't bother with gear. I have attached a doc with some really nice info on ability to keep gains, have a look see for yourself. (File Removed)

Holistix Milk thistle is good, or Solgar..

I think your cyce looks nice,, and you have done some homework,, but I really think you need to add an injectable testosterone with that,, either a test enanthate,, or depotrone

Oh yeah ,, and what netro said,, lay off on the kessar in the beginning of your cycle unless you have a pre-existing gyno problem,, take it if your nipples start getting itchy or puffy or sore

Shot everyone so far for your input!! You guys have all been very informative and the help is much appreciated! I made some changes to the cycle based on your input. Taking something to detox my stomach this weekend, so will only start on Monday with the cycle next week. Going to post all the information I can gather based on my progress during the cycle. Will be recording measurements, weight, body fat, basic weight lifting increases on a weekly basis. Once its done, bad or good will post the results on the site with all cycle information, dietary info etc..

Also on another note, I need some advice on my leg training sessions. I do a-lot of heavy weight leg pressing starting at like 120 upto 180kilos on 4 sets with like 30 reps. It works greats with a combination of leg curls etc... and I use the leg press to exercise my calves.. The only issue is I cant seem to find something that can effectively shape my inner thigh. Its like hrr too soft and probably the only part of my body I am unhappy with at this stage.. since its made absolutely no noticeable progress..... What can I do for this? Except extreme cardio which some may say I already do. +/- an hour during training. if i end up pushing harder on that I might end up looking like one of those guys from kenya that run 50kms a day up hill for fun. Any advice?

Right guys, I have started recording my stats and on the cycle.

Stats were two months ago:
Age: 25
Length: 180cm
Weight: 74Kilos
Fat: 22%

Stats before ECA Cycle: (30 day cycle)
Weight: 82Kilos
Fat: 20%
Supplements: NoMAD ECA + Heat twice a day. (4 tabs)
Comment: Was a f***** nightmare trying to sleep

Stats after ECA cycle: (today starting with cycle)
Weight: 76.6Kilos
Fat: 9.7% <= Thats the shit :>

Will post any increases and changes in weight..

Hopefully I will pick up some bulk to work with from here onwards...

Started bulking cycle yesteday.

ECA stack works! I am living proof!

Oh I noticed a major increase in stamina while starting on the Dinabol as kick off no strength increase as yet.. recovery is super quick though.

dude im not entirely convinced that "spot-training" works but am sure somebody will have a good piece of advice on the matter. My advice is to go have a look at max-ot, i love it and so does alot of other board members. www.ast-ss.com

Greetings,

Sounds awesome, any information is good information Will do some reading up on it... Will sign up for the online course. Shot for the input!

I have a bit of a question that is bothering me now. I am not getting any accurate feed-back or information based on the use during the day of d-bol in the beginning stages of the cycle.

I am currently using 30mg of d-bol 4 hours before training due to the half-life factor of an oral anabolic steroid. Now lets I have a off-day? What then? I am thinking of then splitting the dosages across the day... like 10mg x 3 for example.

My training various from week to week. Weekends are static though. Friday I do back, shoulders and bicep. Saturday I do chest, tricep muscles mostly. Sunday I work on the legs with trainer. Which is pretty damn intensive since his level of training is much higher than mine but on the leg side I keep up untill he starts pushing 200kg+ on the leg press..

I never do the same training during the week, although I fit in as much cardio as possible to burn fat in some stubern areas.

Oh some feedback on the cycle. So far the no-mad dinabol has had no effect on my strength as yet. I seem to recover a little quicker... especially on a really intensive work out.. But I am not see'ing a major strength increase? What can I expect to see? Since everyone has their own opinion, what can you guys tell me? I am trying to figure out if the recovery isnt just part of my imagination


Okay what advice do you guys have for me?

"Due to the short half-life of 3-5 hours, divided doses throughout the day should be taken." roughly one tab every 4hrs up to youre threshold mg's

The use of Dianabol is currently popular for jumpstarting a bulking cycle.For this reason it’s often stacked with longer acting injectables such as Testosterone Cypionate or Enanthate, and Deca-Durabolin. The rationale here with this is that the Dbol will give you a rapid buildup of weight and strength, and those gains can be compounded when the injectables begin to produce results. This is typically done for the first 2-6 weeks of a cycle, with 4 weeks being the most typical time span.

Nice one Dirk.
You can also add winny oral at a low dose in the last 3-4 weeks of your cycle and this will make the last half of your cycle more effective. Also add proviron in the last 2 weeks to keep the water down if you using a compound that aromatizes and causes water retention, common bulking drugs.

a small word of advice if using oxymethalone(anapolon) and are prone to gyno - using kessar(tamoxifen)can be value-less(if not counter productive) due to the progestogenic activity of this drug (this is also true of the nandrolones)Rather use Clomid and if especially sensitive when you start the oxymethelone for every 50mg tab take 25mg proviron this really can help hinder any onset of progesterone related sides
This also applies to Post Cycle Therapy for oxymethelone and the nandrolones(Deca and NNP)use Clomid rather than Kessar as a rule.Hope this helps..

Interesting Conan,
I understand that Kessar won't do anything for progesterone sides, but how does Clomid assist or how is it better at PCT?
I think i'll also go read a bit more on Proviron for combatting sides from NPP - didn't realize it helps.
Cheers

Now that I can use, thanks Conan. Already added Proviron in the last 2 weeks of all my mass stacks and they always have a nandrolone in, just never realised the positive effect, was mainly to hepl with the water.

To answer Jackrabbit let me first say that you need to have estrogen present to get progesterone based gyno and and both clomid and kessar are selective estrogen receptor modulators meaning they block estrogen recptors buy acting as an actual estrogen and clomid does this to much lesser degree(the better of two evils)ideally you should use arimadex or letrozole to destroy 80-90% of the estrogen during your cycle but at between R1000-R2000 for 30 tabs these products can be a little too pricey.Using Clomid and proviron is thus a much cheaper option in many instances.I hope this explains it a little better I have tried to put it into laymans terms for you.

Thanks Conan, was just about to explain that to them..

Conan wrote:

To answer Jackrabbit let me first say that you need to have estrogen present to get progesterone based gyno and and both clomid and kessar are selective estrogen receptor modulators meaning they block estrogen recptors buy acting as an actual estrogen and clomid does this to much lesser degree(the better of two evils)ideally you should use arimadex or letrozole to destroy 80-90% of the estrogen during your cycle but at between R1000-R2000 for 30 tabs these products can be a little too pricey.Using Clomid and proviron is thus a much cheaper option in many instances.I hope this explains it a little better I have tried to put it into laymans terms for you.

what dosages of each would u recommend?

Yes that would be nice to know.
Looks like my planned end-of-cycle/PCT is getting more complicated.
I asked an HCG question on another thread:

www.anabolicsteroids.co.za/forum/func,vi...atid,5/id,1558/#1558
"Conan,
Consider a long cycle and the cahoonas have reached rock-bottom, how much pregnyl at what dose would you recommend?
I thought 1 box (3X1500Iu) would suffice - 500Iu EOD for 3 weeks. I'm starting to doubt that idea and maybe should invest in another box and run it for 6 weeks?! - Wont your body get used to the drug over such a long period of time?

By-the-way, how do you store the devided doses?
Cheers"

The PCT was supposed to start in my last week of cycle. HCG/Kessar.

Now wanting to add proviron/clomid. Maybe its time to sit still for a while and take all this in. Just as you thought you have things wrapped some new insights pop up confusing the issue.

Thanks for all the help.

If i'm going to use proviron and clomid as an AI anyway how would i add HCG and Kessar to the mix for an effective(better) recovery?

500Iu HCG EOD starting the last 2 weeks of cycle with Kessar starting at 20mg/day after the cycle end?

Everybody has their own opinions(looks like) - can't this be a bit less confusing?

I'm on the following at the moment:
100 mg NPP EOD (700 over 2 and 350/week)
130 mg Test Prop EOD (910 over 2 and 445/week)
40-60 mg Anavar/day

Do i swap the Anavar for Proviron 100mg/day + clomid 50mg/day as soon as possible or do i wait to see if i will really develop a problem?

Thanks a million people!