juice virgin

Deadgoat wrote:

N3rd wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

N3rd wrote:

They'll pick up muscle yes, but that is not the point that you made. You said that having more fat somehow makes you stronger, your point was NOT that higher calorie diets in the off season results in fat and muscle gain.

I can train in the off season and pick up muscle but not fat. It took 3 years of experimenting but its doable.

You're right that is what I meant, a fat guy weighing 120 may be able to deadlift and squat 180 even though a ripped 75 kg bodybuilder cant. Size matters my friend

It's about lean muscle mass, that is all that you can compare, but it does not determine strength.
Diet, training style and genetics, not just size.

I beg to differ, lets use a 120kg powerlifter with 25% body fat, and compare him to a 110kg contest ready bodybuilder.
The bodybuilder has more lean body mass but who do you honestly think would be stronger and why?

You cannot compare a powerlifter with a constest ready bodybuilder.
If I were to gain 8% bodyfat and keep my muscle mass the same, I would NOT become stronger. Only my diet, training style and genetics can determine my strength.

N3rd wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

N3rd wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

N3rd wrote:

They'll pick up muscle yes, but that is not the point that you made. You said that having more fat somehow makes you stronger, your point was NOT that higher calorie diets in the off season results in fat and muscle gain.

I can train in the off season and pick up muscle but not fat. It took 3 years of experimenting but its doable.

You're right that is what I meant, a fat guy weighing 120 may be able to deadlift and squat 180 even though a ripped 75 kg bodybuilder cant. Size matters my friend

It's about lean muscle mass, that is all that you can compare, but it does not determine strength.
Diet, training style and genetics, not just size.

I beg to differ, lets use a 120kg powerlifter with 25% body fat, and compare him to a 110kg contest ready bodybuilder.
The bodybuilder has more lean body mass but who do you honestly think would be stronger and why?

You cannot compare a powerlifter with a constest ready bodybuilder.
If I were to gain 8% bodyfat and keep my muscle mass the same, I would NOT become stronger. Only my diet, training style and genetics can determine my strength.

I thought you said "only lean body mass affects strength" or something like that, why do you think most PL like to have a bit of fat on them? I doubt its coz they think chicks dig it
Admit it, I've got you by the balls

Deadgoat wrote:

I thought you said "only lean body mass affects strength" or something like that, why do you think most PL like to have a bit of fat on them? I doubt its coz they think chicks dig it
Admit it, I've got you by the balls

Most people have a little fat on them, from higher calorie diets, and because our bodies can't maintain very low bodyfat percentages for extended periods of time. It still does not affect your strength. I said that diet, training style and genetics determines your strength, not lean body mass.

N3rd wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

I thought you said "only lean body mass affects strength" or something like that, why do you think most PL like to have a bit of fat on them? I doubt its coz they think chicks dig it
Admit it, I've got you by the balls

Most people have a little fat on them, from higher calorie diets, and because our bodies can't maintain very low bodyfat percentages for extended periods of time. It still does not affect your strength. I said that diet, training style and genetics determines your strength, not lean body mass.

To think this whole debate started with you not being able to accept that you're in fact stronger than that guy, you were the one who said you had less LBM than him. Thus inferring the more LBM you have the stronger you are.
I'll think twice before handing out praise next time lol

Deadgoat wrote:

N3rd wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

I thought you said "only lean body mass affects strength" or something like that, why do you think most PL like to have a bit of fat on them? I doubt its coz they think chicks dig it
Admit it, I've got you by the balls

Most people have a little fat on them, from higher calorie diets, and because our bodies can't maintain very low bodyfat percentages for extended periods of time. It still does not affect your strength. I said that diet, training style and genetics determines your strength, not lean body mass.

To think this whole debate started with you not being able to accept that you're in fact stronger than that guy, you were the one who said you had less LBM than him. Thus inferring the more LBM you have the stronger you are.
I'll think twice before handing out praise next time lol

I said that I have more LBM than him and that he has less. Because our weights are close but he has more bodyfat.
To be technical, we are equal at squats, so no one is stronger, I tried to motivate him by saying, job well done, "You lift more weight with less muscle, keep up the good work." That's where I started.
In most cases I'd say that more LBM = more strength, but it still comes down to diet, training style and genetics, that is the only thing that I am inferring.

Aye. . . deadgoat... only you. . you could start a whole new forum with this one topic.

When it comes to stuff like this, you should consider:

1. The methods used to measure weight, body etc (if it VA's little contraption, then its quite off). Accuracy counts here. . .

2. The method at which the questioned exercises were done. i.e: bench press & squats using a smith machine is fairly far from proper bench and squats.

3. As soon as I remember what my 3rd point was, I'll edit this. . .

BleedingEyes wrote:

Aye. . . deadgoat... only you. . you could start a whole new forum with this one topic.

When it comes to stuff like this, you should consider:

1. The methods used to measure weight, body etc (if it VA's little contraption, then its quite off). Accuracy counts here. . .

2. The method at which the questioned exercises were done. i.e: bench press & squats using a smith machine is fairly far from proper bench and squats.

3. As soon as I remember what my 3rd point was, I'll edit this. . .

Lol was just having some fun with him last night, and you're right with the points you raise. N3rd lets just agree to disagree on this one, I still regard you stronger than him. I hope you dont feel insulted too much by that

Deadgoat wrote:

Lol was just having some fun with him last night, and you're right with the points you raise. N3rd lets just agree to disagree on this one, I still regard you stronger than him. I hope you dont feel insulted too much by that

Having fun, it sure looked like that, but you also looked very convinced about what you were saying. We'll just have to agree to disagree, till someone else comes here and also proves you wrong
I don't feel insulted, its just that the guy has less LBM, and thats a FACT, but he squats the same as me. You may believe that I'm stronger, but that is only based on your personal opinion and no facts.

I apologise to everyone for highjacking this thread, I only wanted to lift out some facts behind a reasoning.
Peace

Hmmm...anyways the only reason I can see that having more body fat making you stronger is that your muscles need to work harder to accomodate the extra body weight that you carry. Other than that I dont agree with deadgoat as your LBM, as well as bone strength will be the major determining factor of strength which is influenced by genetics and diet so Im going with n3rd on this one

Hi Guys sorry to hijack the thread, But Beesting love you personal text message....

Beesting wrote:

Hmmm...anyways the only reason I can see that having more body fat making you stronger is that your muscles need to work harder to accomodate the extra body weight that you carry. Other than that I dont agree with deadgoat as your LBM, as well as bone strength will be the major determining factor of strength which is influenced by genetics and diet so Im going with n3rd on this one

Who do you think would be stronger a fat kid or a skinny kid, both had exactly the same LBM? And dont give me any "it depends" BS

Deadgoat wrote:

Who do you think would be stronger a fat kid or a skinny kid, both had exactly the same LBM? And dont give me any "it depends" BS

dude, I dont know what your problem is and I dont argue over the internet, lets just make that clear. I simply gave my point of view and that is where Im leaving it

Beesting wrote:

Deadgoat wrote:

Who do you think would be stronger a fat kid or a skinny kid, both had exactly the same LBM? And dont give me any "it depends" BS

dude, I dont know what your problem is and I dont argue over the internet, lets just make that clear. I simply gave my point of view and that is where Im leaving it

I apologise, I may have been a bit too aggressive in trying to prove my point. Hope we're cool

Well. . . it does depend. I have a (feel bad saying it) very over weight cousin, he's 24/25. He tried gymming with me and did bench press. . . the bar, on its own, no weights. And went the same direction with other body groups. Yet I know this kid, who is skrawny but strong because he lifts & carries boxes all day.

I say it comes down to individuality:)

Yep we're cool, no worries. Anyways I dont think its fair that you try and prove your point in this thread, rather start a new thread because its been majorly jacked and its only fair to the member who started this thread

Beesting wrote:

Yep we're cool, no worries. Anyways I dont think its fair that you try and prove your point in this thread, rather start a new thread because its been majorly jacked and its only fair to the member who started this thread

Will do, bleeding I'll respond to you in the new thread